Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by stu3ufc on Sat May 14, 2016 1:51 pm

CDF47 wrote:^Coker has done quite a bit in a short time

indeed he has but who knows what Bjorn would have done also if they changed the model to bi weekly events instead of weekly events.

I do agree at some point now in hindsight that the tournaments and weekly events were spreading bellator thin plus issues with fighters having to do tournies again for a title shot. Good to see the events are in bigger arenas and selling well and ratings are up with some bigger names.... that have been signed coming out of contract from the UFC.

Bjorn laid the foundation though...coker is taking it to another level with his experience and contacts/ good reputation



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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by CDF47 on Sat May 14, 2016 1:55 pm

stu3ufc wrote:
CDF47 wrote:^Coker has done quite a bit in a short time

indeed he has but who knows what Bjorn would have done also if they changed the model to bi weekly events instead of weekly events.

I do agree at some point now in hindsight that the tournaments and weekly events were spreading bellator thin plus issues with fighters having to do tournies again for a title shot. Good to see the events are in bigger arenas and selling well and ratings are up with some bigger names.... that have been signed coming out of contract from the UFC.

Bjorn laid the foundation though...coker is taking it to another level with his experience and contacts/ good reputation

I totally agree Stu. I always like Bjorn as well. This was his org. from the start and he did some great things with it. I am glad to see them continuing to do well and I like the ways things are looking right now.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by stu3ufc on Sun May 15, 2016 2:55 am

that said bellator cant even keep their fucking champions!

remember when everyone bashed bjorn for losing eddie and now that coker lost brooks no one says nothing

coker sucks!


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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by fka on Sun May 15, 2016 12:24 pm

Lmao bjorn lost more then eddie...

Lombard and cole konrad,plus former champs good,and makovsky.


Gimme a break lmfao

Your acting like this wasnt announced months ago...brooks wanted out to test free agency.


Minakov shoulda been stripped ages ago....kinda like coke konrad and bjorn except cole retired due to inactivity cuz of tournaments and not fighting anyone even close to being good lol.....oh and minakov is still in bellator fir now.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by TeepToTheJunk on Sun May 15, 2016 1:16 pm

stu3ufc wrote:that said bellator cant even keep their fucking champions!

remember when everyone bashed bjorn for losing eddie and now that coker lost brooks no one says nothing

coker sucks!
Bjorn didn't lose EA, he tied him up and Coker released him, when he couldn't patch up Bjorn's mess.  

This worked out for the best.  Fighters aren't a simple commodity. You don't want to see Nurmy vs Brooks? Will can go do his thing, which is what he wanted. The UFC should release Cung Le.  They did him dirty. He wants to fight, but not for them.  It would be a great PR move if they did.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by CDF47 on Sun May 15, 2016 5:11 pm

stu3ufc wrote:that said bellator cant even keep their fucking champions!

remember when everyone bashed bjorn for losing eddie and now that coker lost brooks no one says nothing

coker sucks!


I remember Bjorn getting bashed a bit for that.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by CDF47 on Sun May 15, 2016 5:13 pm

fka wrote:Lmao bjorn lost more then eddie...

Lombard and cole konrad,plus former champs good,and makovsky.


Gimme a break lmfao

Your acting like this wasnt announced months ago...brooks wanted out to test free agency.


Minakov shoulda been stripped ages ago....kinda like coke konrad and bjorn except cole retired due to inactivity cuz of tournaments and not fighting anyone even close to being good lol.....oh and minakov is still in bellator fir now.

Yeah, they did lose some good champs as well. Konrad just retired out of nowhere for a business opportunity but Eddie and Lombard were their two biggest losses to UFC.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by TeepToTheJunk on Sun May 15, 2016 8:03 pm

I'm working on an in depth analysis of Bellator's tentpole era (B131-B154) Domestic TV numbers including initial numbers, +3DVR and peak audiences.

Also working to gather info on their international TV reach to the degree it's available.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by CDF47 on Sun May 15, 2016 8:41 pm

TeepToTheJunk wrote:I'm working on an in depth analysis of Bellator's tentpole era (B131-B154) Domestic TV numbers including initial numbers, +3DVR and peak audiences.

Also working to gather info on their international TV reach to the degree it's available.

Will be interesting to see how they did

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by fka on Sun May 15, 2016 10:28 pm

Ive done similar research feel free to use mine too.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by TeepToTheJunk on Sun May 15, 2016 10:44 pm

CDF47 wrote:
TeepToTheJunk wrote:I'm working on an in depth analysis of Bellator's tentpole era (B131-B154) Domestic TV numbers including initial numbers, +3DVR and peak audiences.

Also working to gather info on their international TV reach to the degree it's available.

Will be interesting to see how they did
I've noticed mmapayout.com, mmafighting.com, and others often use the initial average numbers referring to Bellator events even in the past, but when TUF does god awful #'s they make sure to emphasize +3DVR.  There's a lot of bias in the conversation about domestic #'s.

Bellator generates content for (EDIT) 140+ countries. The US market is lucrative, but only a sliver  of the entire game.  Still, it's worth a closer look.

The piece I'm planning will give us the real domestic picture.  Coker said tentpoles are the future of Bellator. We never see analysis of strictly tentpole events.  Eventually they'll do 12, +Dynamite (or maybe including) plus hybrids and kickboxing shows.  The non tentpoles are not the point, even though they've generally been good shows.

This is the perfect place to set the US TV numbers straight.  Give me a few days.  We're going to look at the nitty-gritty. I'm halfway finished researching.


Last edited by TeepToTheJunk on Tue May 17, 2016 12:05 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by TeepToTheJunk on Sun May 15, 2016 10:55 pm

fka wrote:Ive done similar research feel free to use mine too.
Thanks, brother.

It would be EPIC if we could maintain a ratings,#'s,gate,crowd etc database even for only a few orgs.  Track the big picture, to the degree we're able.  No one that I've seen is doing that.

I've been wasting my time arguing with shills on SBN (some cool posters though), big shit is going down, it's time to get positive.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by CDF47 on Mon May 16, 2016 5:54 pm

TeepToTheJunk wrote:
CDF47 wrote:
TeepToTheJunk wrote:I'm working on an in depth analysis of Bellator's tentpole era (B131-B154) Domestic TV numbers including initial numbers, +3DVR and peak audiences.

Also working to gather info on their international TV reach to the degree it's available.

Will be interesting to see how they did
I've noticed mmapayout.com, mmafighting.com, and others often use the initial average numbers referring to Bellator events even in the past, but when TUF does god awful #'s they make sure to emphasize +3DVR.  There's a lot of bias in the conversation about domestic #'s.

Bellator generates content for 150 countries. The US market is lucrative, but only a sliver  of the entire game.  Still, it's worth a closer look.

The piece I'm planning will give us the real domestic picture.  Coker said tentpoles are the future of Bellator. We never see analysis of strictly tentpole events.  Eventually they'll do 12, +Dynamite (or maybe including) plus hybrids and kickboxing shows.  The non tentpoles are not the point, even though they've generally been good shows.

This is the perfect place to set the US TV numbers straight.  Give me a few days.  We're going to look at the nitty-gritty. I'm halfway finished researching.

Interesting that the promoters ratings are reported differently but not surprising.

Will be interesting to see how those numbers breakout with some analysis.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by CDF47 on Mon May 16, 2016 5:55 pm

TeepToTheJunk wrote:
fka wrote:Ive done similar research feel free to use mine too.
Thanks, brother.

It would be EPIC if we could maintain a ratings,#'s,gate,crowd etc database even for only a few orgs.  Track the big picture, to the degree we're able.  No one that I've seen is doing that.

I've been wasting my time arguing with shills on SBN (some cool posters though), big shit is going down, it's time to get positive.

A database like that with some sound honest analysis would be real good.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by TeepToTheJunk on Tue May 17, 2016 12:04 am

CDF47 wrote:
TeepToTheJunk wrote:
fka wrote:Ive done similar research feel free to use mine too.
Thanks, brother.

It would be EPIC if we could maintain a ratings,#'s,gate,crowd etc database even for only a few orgs.  Track the big picture, to the degree we're able.  No one that I've seen is doing that.

I've been wasting my time arguing with shills on SBN (some cool posters though), big shit is going down, it's time to get positive.

A database like that with some sound honest analysis would be real good.
I've gathered much of what I need for some Bellator articles.  Here are my planed pieces:

First up a close look at live attendance, with an eye on venue selection and how Coker is navigating their preexisting obligations (little casinos).  This'll be up in a day or two. The #'s show a clear trend toward the EPIC. Included will be a projection of future 2016 crowds inferred from announced upcoming venues.  Average #'s by venue will be included.  This'll let us get a realistic view of what's happening, what's plausible moving forward and as things unfold, we can measure their growth re: live crowds.

An analysis of domestic TV numbers, for B131-154 including Overnight averages/peaks and +3 DVR averages/peaks.  This includes a look at which headliners drew what, and in what venues, as TV look and feel isn't the same in rinky dink Bjorn era holdover obligated venues.

A follow-up article relating those numbers back to Bjornator.

A piece relating Bellator domestic #'s to WSOF and the UFC.  Maybe Glory later.

Finally a longform article on live crowds for all the major orgs, covering the last few years.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by stu3ufc on Tue May 17, 2016 2:53 am

fka wrote:Ive done similar research feel free to use mine too.

lol Rolling LMAO

lets compare the brand when it was on espn deportees with events on casinos to when it became majorly established on spike after 5 years


yeah great comparisons guys!!!

lets bow to coker for all the work he did making bellator what it is today.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by iforgotmypassword on Tue May 17, 2016 8:31 am

lets compare apples vs apples. I've done my own research as well FKA. Feel free to use my csv files.


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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by TeepToTheJunk on Tue May 17, 2016 12:01 pm

stu3ufc wrote:
fka wrote:Ive done similar research feel free to use mine too.

lol Rolling LMAO

lets compare the brand when it was on espn deportees with events on casinos to when it became majorly established on spike after 5 years


yeah great comparisons guys!!!

lets bow to coker for all the work he did making bellator what it is today.
 I think it'd be useful to see steps Coker and team have taken.  

Bellator 131, the Tentpole era kickoff was Bellator's 132nd event. They got 8,243 live at the (new venue for them I think) Valley View Casino Center, and Tito/Bonnar was the most watched and highest rated cable mma fight of 2014.  

B132 was at the pre-obligated Pechanga Resort and Casino in Temecula, Ca.  A crowd of 1,300.  There have been 3 tentpole era shows at that venue.  Average crowd - 1,233.  Certain venues are only hosting Spikeforce based on Bjorn holdover obligations.  

Post B131 shows at Pechanga R&C, Kansas Star Casino and Winstar World Casino totalling 8 events COMBINED are about the same audience as their one show at the Toyota center 13,209  (B149). Things are changing.  Look at their last six shows

149 Toyota Center 13,209
150 Kansas Star Casino 3,288
151 Winstar World Casino 1,152

152 Pala Alpitour 13,067
153 Mohegan Sun 9,043
154 SAP Center 11,084

Bjornator had Mohegan Sun, but Coker has added big venues and once they've run through their venue obligations those little places are gone.  The future is big live shows.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by CDF47 on Tue May 17, 2016 7:08 pm

TeepToTheJunk wrote:
stu3ufc wrote:
fka wrote:Ive done similar research feel free to use mine too.

lol Rolling LMAO

lets compare the brand when it was on espn deportees with events on casinos to when it became majorly established on spike after 5 years


yeah great comparisons guys!!!

lets bow to coker for all the work he did making bellator what it is today.
 I think it'd be useful to see steps Coker and team have taken.  

Bellator 131, the Tentpole era kickoff was Bellator's 132nd event. They got 8,243 live at the (new venue for them I think) Valley View Casino Center, and Tito/Bonnar was the most watched and highest rated cable mma fight of 2014.  

B132 was at the pre-obligated Pechanga Resort and Casino in Temecula, Ca.  A crowd of 1,300.  There have been 3 tentpole era shows at that venue.  Average crowd - 1,233.  Certain venues are only hosting Spikeforce based on Bjorn holdover obligations.  

Post B131 shows at Pechanga R&C, Kansas Star Casino and Winstar World Casino totalling 8 events COMBINED are about the same audience as their one show at the Toyota center 13,209  (B149). Things are changing.  Look at their last six shows

149 Toyota Center 13,209
150 Kansas Star Casino 3,288
151 Winstar World Casino 1,152

152 Pala Alpitour 13,067
153 Mohegan Sun 9,043
154 SAP Center 11,084

Bjornator had Mohegan Sun, but Coker has added big venues and once they've run through their venue obligations those little places are gone.  The future is big live shows.

Interesting figures.  Coker has done some good things with Bellator pretty quickly.  Bjorn was the org. founder and he did well. I think Coker can take Bellator to the next level with his vision of the sport.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by fka on Tue May 17, 2016 7:48 pm

Poor stu.....he still thinks spike and viacom spend more on cokers version....

In reality bjorn was so business savy he had ZERO working relationship with spike.....lmao

Bjorn laid a foundation and did well with what he had.....but coker changed his vision and has done better in every performance indicator.

Coker had the same shit to work with that bjorn did....nit like he tookover with a brand new budget and roster....

Coker has no doubt turned bellator into the legit #2 in the world not just the default #2.Atheletes call bellator for jobs......not bellator begging for a decent name.Bellator was a last resort now its a legit option to get paid and make a name for yourself.


Bjorn was good....but Coker is just better.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by fka on Tue May 17, 2016 7:52 pm

Lmao bellator still runs shows in casinos stu......except now they draw crowds large enough to make money,and are able to book bigger venues and go out of the country.....oh did i mention the founding of bellator kickboxing?

Coker is elevating the brand despite the geezer fights people are jumping on the bandwagon.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by stu3ufc on Wed May 18, 2016 12:52 am

fka wrote:oh did i mention the founding of bellator kickboxing?

What? some 5th rate american kickboxing org with mma weigh classes and d level mma strikers

yeah have fun watching that shit.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by iforgotmypassword on Wed May 18, 2016 2:59 am

bellator kickboxing is a insult to any kickboxing fan's intelligence. I hope you dont run your painting company like scoot does bellator, FKA. Or else you would be buying 5th rate paint for peoples houses.

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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by TeepToTheJunk on Wed May 18, 2016 3:24 am

What are you two on about?

BELLATOR KICKBOXING: TORINO FIGHT CARD
Bellator Kickboxing Middleweight Main Event: Melvin Manhoef (37-12) vs. Alexandru Negrea (8-2)
Bellator Kickboxing 165-Pound Feature Bout: Mustapha Haida (37-3-3) vs. Karim Ghajji (95-12)
Bellator Kickboxing Welterweight Feature Bout: Raymond Daniels (10-3) vs. Francesco Moricca (15-2-1)
Bellator Kickboxing Flyweight Feature Bout: Denise Kielholtz (43-2) vs. Veronica Vernocchi (31-6-1)
Bellator Kickboxing Bantamweight Feature Bout: Kevin Ross (30-9) vs. Matteo Taccini (24-3-1)


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Re: Coker vs Bjorn by the numbers

Post by fka on Wed May 18, 2016 10:37 am

They are the 2 local bellator bashers lol.

I enjoyed the first bellator kickboxing show look forward to more.

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